Well this is interesting. Blizzard just posted that they’re planning on redoing the forums to show our real names. They will not be adding your real name to existing forum posts, however if you choose to display your character under your new profile, people will probably be able to go and look up everything you’ve posted on that character.
Why?
Trolls. They are the bane of the internet, especially popular places on the internet. Doubly so on forums that contain people who are vulnerable to trolling (read: regular people). Even reasonable, well meaning people can begin to display internet fuckwad characteristics when involved in a heated debate where they feel that their real name is anonymous. In fact, anonymity is directly related to trolling. See 4chan.
So?
In Blizzard’s mind, this means that serial trolls will stop posting, and trollish behavior among normal people will be reduced. There is no action without an equal and opposite reaction, however. In this case, assuming that the forums are still public, every single thing you post about concerning this silly little hobby of ours will start to show up when people search for your name. Unless you’re willing to walk into your boss’s office with a printout of what you just said, you won’t be able to write it on the official forums. For many people, this will prevent them from doing more than trolling- it will prevent them from normal conversations.
Additionally, even if you’re not worried about having WoW references litter search results for your name, if you offend anyone in any way, all they need to do to pay you back is put a trivial amount of work into it, and they will be able to ruin your life. I mean it.
Srsly?
Ya. They don’t need to “uncover secrets” or “come to your door to see if you’ll say it to their face”, all they need to do is email your kid’s principal that they’re worried about abuse. Email your boss asking for a reference for a new job, and email your wife sexy pictures addressed to you.
So why do you do it?
When I took the job at wow.com, they insisted that I write using my real name. I did it knowing that they harbor some of the most vicious trolls on the internet, short of 4chan, and the only reason it’s even remotely worth the risk is that I can now say that I’m a “professional” writer. I talked to my family and friends before I started, and keep a baseball bat near the door these days, though.
Euripides
jurgwena
lemli
eidotrope
pherra
femaledwarf
Its worse than that.
It ruins the escapism that this game was built on.
Therefore, this goes through. I’m done.
I wouldn’t have an issue if they made every player choose one main character and all posts to the forums would show that name. I wouldn’t even mind if everyone could see my alts by clicking on that character. Seeing my real name is a step too far and I won’t use the forums if that happens.
It does seem like the same goal could be accomplished by tying all posts to a single character name, without revealing the real names of players.
Anonymity still breeds troll behavior. There’s got to be a middle ground, though.
I’ve tried, though not always succeeded, in being a voice of reason on the server forum. Several of my best guild members are people I helped via the forum.
I think I’m going to quit posting if this comes through.
I have always posted on my main, even those times when the snark came out. For the record, my boss knows I play. His son plays, too. I don’t play at work, but I do read material and post to the guild web site during down time. So, in theory, I don’t have much to “hide”.
But what’s going to go is that little bit of authority some people have on the forum. There are people on my realm who have been around since WOW was beta. They have a huge body of experience and knowledge. If someone posts a question, it is very likely someone will respond with an answer, just as sure as there are trolls who will post garbage. I have been known to, after a vacation, hit the forum and search by a specific player’s name, just to see what he or she has posted while I’ve been gone. With real names, how do I know if Bob Smith is posting from experience or just shooting off his mouth?
I hope this change doesn’t happen. I won’t post and I, eventually, I’ll stop going to the forum for information or entertainment. I see this as an effort to help their forum moderators by cutting down on the amount of “troll removal” work they have to do. But this isn’t the way to stimulate conversation.
If the goal is to make the forums a better place, it can be accomplished without real names. Post/poster rating, having a consistent displayed userid (main char name or something, doesn’t have to be a real name), etc are all reasonable ways to improve the quality of posting. Forcing people’s real names on posts is a terrible idea and I really hope Blizzard backs down before this gets out of hand.
I’ve never been incredibly privacy oriented but that’s been by choice. Since I run several public websites I’m kind of used to it. But I’m infuriated that Blizzard feels it’s appropriate to take that choice away from me if I choose to participate in their public forums. I post on the forums to help people, but I’m certainly wondering now if I really want to do that with this change coming. Many people whose information is more private than me will for sure stop posting. A lot of folks who currently post in a trolling fashion won’t be discouraged, many of those are immature folks who don’t even get why they’d care about their privacy, at least not till it bites them in the ass. In the end the quality of the forums may go down and not up. Chances are most responsible posters will jump ship to a more intelligently run forum.
The interesting thing is the people arguing that somehow the forum posts will improve if people’s real names are included, yet they also argue that someone having your real name is nothing to be concerned about. Those two beliefs are contradictory- if your name being public is supposed to discourage you from inappropriate posting it follows that there is some risk involved in providing your name. If there is really no risk involved, then why would it improve the quality of posts?
Welcome to the real world, kids.
The real world is a world that allows you to interact with a modicum of privacy.
To clarify- I understand that in the real world, we need to, for example, show our ID to vote. I have no assumptions about true anonymity. The difference here is that you don’t have to show the other voters your ID and vote.
It’s obviously a personal opinion, but I am yet to see one good reason arguing against this change.
The voting analogy is interesting. I believe that voting anonymity has nothing to do with protecting personal privacy and instead serves to reinforce the integrity of the democratic process.
The keyboard warriors will have no place to hide on the WoW forums. Muahahahahaaaa…
Here’s an argument: good people who contribute to the forums by answering questions will have to risk being RL trolled. As in, with a real name, and maybe some hints about where you live from your posting history, a troll can find out all sorts of disturbingly accurate information well beyond what should be available to other people whose only thing in common is that they play the same game.
Yet to see a good arguement for making this change? Are you kidding me?
Try this, google your name. Now google your main toons name.
Posting in the WoW forums with your real name identified will now open that post up to the entire world to see. Including prospective bosses.
Done with an interview? Guess what the person that interviewed you is doing now, as well as the person in charge of HR. Yep, googling your name and visiting any social media site associated with you.
So what happens when they google your name and 3 pages of WoW forums postings comes up? They only need to remember reading one single hack article about how WoW players ‘make bad employees’ and BAM, no job for you.
If you think any of that is even a slight exaggeration, you need to pull your head out.
“The keyboard warriors will have no place to hide on the WoW forums”
Of course they will. They will hide behind their mother’s real name. Or behind their own extremely common name.
What are you going to do about it? Drive to their house and beat them up?
“What are you going to do about it? Drive to their house and beat them up?”
I wouldn’t worry about someone coming to my house. I can handle myself just fine, and have a Louisville Slugger behind the door for emergencies.
I can live without the pizza deliveries, prank phone calls, and similar garbage that comes from offending the wrong 12 year old in the forums.
I would be worried less if I was Bob Smith, but those of us with more unique names don’t have that to hide behind. (Right Basil? :) )
I think this is a bad idea, and worry who needs to get hurt for Blizzard to figure it out. This will all go away the second someone’s kid gets killed because some nutbar got angry in the forums, and Blizz gets a multi-million dollar lawsuit.
This Blizzard ruling made me think of a recent Supreme Court ruling:
http://articles.latimes.com/2010/jun/25/nation/la-na-supreme-court-petition-20100625
The Supreme Court feels that attaching real names to public statements (specifically, petitions) deters fraud and promotes accountability. Blizzard’s motives are similar, I think, to those in the court’s ruling. Blizzard wants people to take ownership of their words for the purpose of better communal discourse.
This comparison with the court’s ruling breaks down on the point that WoW is not a sovereign democracy. While transparency and accountability may be good for WoW’s official forums, the fact that WoW is a game means that these virtues are not of existential importance (as they arguably are for democracies). I do not see how these benefits for the forums outweigh players’ needs for privacy.
What also concerns me is that this may be counterproductive to the aim of good player/designer relations. Good governance involves not just transparency but also conversation. By forcing players to reveal their names in order to provide comments, Blizzard is I think discouraging both misconduct and feedback. I only ever visited the forums to report bugs or suggest game improvements. I won’t be doing that anymore.
To use an example from D&D forums.
D&D is owned by WotC. WotC’s forums are pretty much the same as Blizzard’s – many well-behaved individuals attempting to help and many trolls.
But then there is ENWorld. A public forum where moderators are fast to lock threads and edit comments. Their rules – don’t post anything about politics or religion, and don’t say anything that a normal person wouldn’t say to their grandmother. Trolls find it harder to troll there and usually move on.
It’s kind of a middleground between the “official” forums and the harsher playground that is the EJ forums.
So IMO, the official forums won’t change (or may get worse), but another forum will reap the benefits of the intelligencia of WoW forums finding a new home.
“Additionally, even if you’re not worried about having WoW references litter search results for your name, if you offend anyone in any way, all they need to do to pay you back is put a trivial amount of work into it, and they will be able to ruin your life. I mean it.”
Slight issue with that: if you offend anyone in any way, anywhere on the internet, using any nickname, under any kind of security barrier, it still takes a trivial or nearly trivial amount of work to find out who you are, where you live and how to ruin your life. It’s that simple to track someone over the internet if you know what you’re doing.
If a troll wants to screw you up in real life, he’s going to do it regardless of whether he’s got your real name or not. Most simply don’t have the inclination, the technical skills, or the free time for it. Those who do are already dangerous, that’s not gonna change in any way with RealID.
Either way, I expect Blizzard to enforce their forum rules a -lot- more harshly after this change comes through. If they say this is to stop with trolls, they need to punish those that still troll after it’s implemented.
“I wouldn’t worry about someone coming to my house.”
Apparently, I didn’t make my point clearly enough. I am not talking about what they do to you, but rather what you do to them. Say, a troll posts post you find offensive, what does knowing that Bob Smith is their real name do for you to get them to stop?
Elitist Jerks is a good counter example. No trolling is tolerated there, and though the conversation gets harsh at times, it’s signal/noise is very high. No real ID required.
There are many ways to remove trolling without requiring real names. Even just requiring a real main character would probably be somewhat effective. Community moderation would also work, as trolls who post on their main would eventually get such a bad reputation that their posts start out invisible.
As ive done on the wow hunter forums and many others since this started..
Hi my names Paul Lonergan… go nuts
Paul Lonergan? The Tightwad?
http://twitter.com/thetightwad
Bit off topic, but anyway, are podcast episodes 25, 28, and 29 ever going to go up?
We lost Frost’s portion of 25 (which was before we were recording all tracks into one file), but I’ll look for 28 and 29. I thought I had gotten them…
[...] of Grey OutDPS Kurn’s Corner Life in Group 5 Mental Shaman Preposterous Pretentious Prattle Binds to Account [...]
By any chance would that bat be a 9mm or a 12 gauge?
Haha, a 9 mm bat would be so ineffective! You’d be all like “Come here and get some, you damn troll” and he’d be like “OMG, what are you rubbing between your fingers at me?”
Seriously, though: having anything more dangerous than a bat is probably a bad idea. While this is way off topic, you’re far more likely to hurt or lose a loved one to a weapon in the house by accident than you are to ever use it on an invader or someone. Also, anything you can’t do with a bat, you can probably go to jail for.
I find it odd that Blizzard would make this change, considering that their own privacy policy says:
The personal information you provide Blizzard will allow us to fulfill your product or service order; alert you of new products or services, features, or enhancements; handle/route your customer service or technical support questions or issues; to send eCards or “Recruit-a-Friend” emails; and/or notify you of upgrade opportunities, contests, promotions, or special events and offers. Blizzard may enhance or merge the personal information collected at a Blizzard site with data from third parties. Blizzard may also provide your personal information to other companies or organizations that offer products or services that may be of interest to you. In such cases, we will notify you that the information will be shared and provide you with an opportunity to opt-out.
Seems to me that releasing our real names for any forum posts would violate their stated privacy policy… I could be mistaken in how I’m interpreting the policy tho. Chime in and let me know what you think.
Full Policy at: http://us.blizzard.com/en-us/company/about/privacy.html
For one reason or another, they changed their minds on this and reversed their decision a day after announcing it.
Do not quite understand what is at stake.